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A Song of Ice and Fire / A Song of Ice and Fire / Cover art

labor Jun 13th 6:56 AM

Well, people, I just can't keep it to myself. I have accidentially seen a german translation of AGOT. It is split in two volumes as usual (easier to milk your readers that way, as each german volume costs almost as much as the whole book in English).
And on the cover of the second volume is depicted a muscle packed, scantily clad barbarian horseman who is killing wolves (actual animals!) with an axe!!! Now we can hope it's Shagga, but I have a gloomy feeling that it's got to be a terribly misunderstood Tyrion...

Ran
User ID: 0283314 Jun 13th 7:22 AM
Reminds me vaguely of the first Conan story, in which the young former-slave is trapped by wolves, finds a nifty sword, and kills 'em all (if you've seen the film, they've still got that one.)

Hurrah for Tyrion, Mr. Seven Kingdoms. ;)

Emily
User ID: 2331104 Jun 13th 11:52 AM
Blimey...it sounds even worse that the UK covers. Is the figure a hideous swashed-nose odd-eyed dwarf? That would be a bit of a give-away that it's supposed to be Tyrion. Just out of interest, do you know where the Germans split AGOT?

Ser Gary
User ID: 9279843 Jun 13th 3:54 PM
I was just wondering. Do other people think cover art is as important as I do? Many times, it is the quality of the cover art that draws me in to at least pick a book up and read the back-page summary. I bought AGOT (American version) based purely on the quality of its cover art. C.S. Friedman's Coldfire trilogy also had terrific cover art, and that's what got me reading that trilogy. I found G.G.Kay's cover art intriguing, and jumped in for some of that as well.

Min
User ID: 9433023 Jun 14th 5:20 PM
Here is the specialist for the german covers.

The first one is quite bad already, but, yes, labor, the second one is horrible. It actually is by the same "artist" who made the Conan-covers, and the guy on the cover actually looke like Conan. And, sadly, he is not meant to be Tyrion. The guy on the german cover is meant to be either Jon or Robb. Why they should _kill_ wolves, no one will ever understand... but it is so.

Cover art _is_ important, and I can tell you why the german ones are so bad. It is the same reason why every GRRM book is split in two (though milking the readers is a strong reason for that, too). Fantasy as a genre is not accepted as a genre for intelligent people at all in germany.

I talked with a friend who ownes a fantasy-bookstore in Berlin and actually translates fantasy epics into german. He said that the publishers seem to think that
a) german fantasy fans cannot read a book which has more than 200 pages
b) just reads books with "Conans" on the cover
c) is not interested in a good, literarical use of language, but just in action - which is why most of the fantasy translations are really bad (which, again, is why I always read the books in English). Translaters for fantasy, e.g., are paid not a quarter of the money translaters of other literature get...

It really is a pity. But GRRM is lucky still: Robert Jordan's books were each torn into three ot four volumes...

Min
User ID: 9433023 Jun 24th 6:55 AM
You do not really seem to be interested in the problems of german fantasy readers, are you?
;-)

KAH
User ID: 9209903 Jun 24th 8:58 AM
I see that you mention translators.

Don't get me started on Norwegian translators, it'll be one big rant.

Ser Gary
User ID: 8068153 Jun 24th 8:58 AM
Who? Oh yeah. I personally like my fantasy books to be big and bold. I'm not sure I'd purchase a fantasy book that was less than 300 pages unless it was HIGHLY recommended.

Min
User ID: 9433023 Jun 24th 10:20 AM
Are you not reading the Farseers right now? I think each book has not so many pages... there are three of them, though.

Btw, I am glad you liked them. Hobb is great, I think.

Ser Gary
User ID: 8068153 Jun 24th 10:40 AM
The first book is not as big as the other two, but they all go safely past my 300 page minimum. Hobb is a definite talent.

Paula
User ID: 9321503 Jun 28th 4:36 PM
I mentioned this on the old board, but I really found it interesting so I will mention it again. The US cover of ACOK looks a lot like a painting by EB Leighton called The Accolade. You can see it at the following site:
http://www.bmcgaw.com/detail.phtml?catalog_nu=L232

It basically depicts a queen knighting a man, who is kneeling in front of her. Her dress is drawn almost exactly like Meliisandre's and the kneeling man looks just like Davros only in a slightly different position. There are some other similarities but those are the main ones.

Generic Eric
User ID: 8339223 Feb 18th 3:59 PM
Okay, I hope no one takes me for blind...but I would assume that is Jon on the paperback cover of AGOT??

I don't have AGOT here with me; and I cannot recall Jon's features, yet the sword has a wolf's head pommel, so I guess that would be Jon.

Someone help me out--what are Jon's features as described in the book anyway? I can't recall.

KAH
User ID: 0541004 Feb 20th 7:05 AM
Eric;

It's certainly Jon that is depicted (wearing black, followed by a wolf), although he looks far too old.

I cannot recall much about Jon's description. Grey eyes, brown hair(I think), slimmer build than Robb.

Ran
User ID: 0867924 Feb 20th 8:17 AM
That's about it. Shorter than Joffrey, as well, who is very tall for his age apparently.

Generic Eric
User ID: 8339223 Feb 20th 10:32 AM
Thats what caused me to hesitate--the age factor. He looked way too old to be Jon. But there is no other option really.

Byron
User ID: 0798784 Feb 20th 2:34 PM
I totally agree...he looked ten years too old to be Jon. I also didn't think he had long hair...does it ever say this in the book?

BTW, I heard recently that the UK version of ASOS will have a swordfight(how appropriate), and the US version will have a funeral, both taken from scenes in the book. So, what do you think? Who's the swordfight between? Whose funeral?

Ran
User ID: 0867924 Feb 20th 2:42 PM
No reference as to hair length, though it seems most men wear their hair to or just off their shoulders. Still, that was too long even for him.

As for the discussion of the cover, I thought we had one elsewhere .. For my part, I like to think that the swordfight would be between Gregor and Sandor -- but it might be rather generic. The funeral, who knows. Hoster is like to day in this book. So are, probably, a number of others. I can't see Robb having a nice, calm funeral however.

Dirjj
User ID: 6960173 Feb 22nd 2:40 PM
Hmm, I have a question (theory) and this theory, if accurate, would make casting for a "fictional" movie, easier.

We are basing characters ages on Terran terms. We all know that the seasons are different on the World of ASOI&F, especially on Westeros. But, what if their planet circled the sun at a different rate than our own, and a year to them, is actually a little more than a year to us. Say 1 Terran year is equal to 16 Westeri months. That would make Jon closer to 20, and Bran closer to 12. It would only make Arya 10, but then some of her actions would be more believable.

ab

Ran
User ID: 0867924 Feb 22nd 3:02 PM
On the other hand, it'd make Sansa 16, terribly late to get her period when noble girls tend to get them rather early (because of the overall healthier diets, including a lot more protien and fat and such from meat, I suppose.)

It'd also somewhat contradict Martin's statements about 12-14 being seen as 'too young' to give birth to a child in general. While 16 is rather early IRL and there are associated problems with giving early birth, it's at least relatively stable and safe, all in all. I'm not sure they would concern themselves as much as they apparently do if 12 is our 16.

labor	Jun 13th 6:56 AM Well, people, I just can't keep it to myself. I have accidentially seen a german translation of AGOT. It is split in two volumes as usual (easier to milk your readers that way, as each german volume costs almost as much as the whole book in English). And on the cover of the second volume is depicted a muscle packed, scantily clad barbarian horseman who is killing wolves (actual animals!) with an axe!!! Now we can hope it's Shagga, but I have a gloomy feeling that it's got to be a terribly misunderstood Tyrion...
Ran User ID: 0283314	Jun 13th 7:22 AM Reminds me vaguely of the first Conan story, in which the young former-slave is trapped by wolves, finds a nifty sword, and kills 'em all (if you've seen the film, they've still got that one.) Hurrah for Tyrion, Mr. Seven Kingdoms. ;)
Emily User ID: 2331104	Jun 13th 11:52 AM Blimey...it sounds even worse that the UK covers. Is the figure a hideous swashed-nose odd-eyed dwarf? That would be a bit of a give-away that it's supposed to be Tyrion. Just out of interest, do you know where the Germans split AGOT?
Ser Gary User ID: 9279843	Jun 13th 3:54 PM I was just wondering. Do other people think cover art is as important as I do? Many times, it is the quality of the cover art that draws me in to at least pick a book up and read the back-page summary. I bought AGOT (American version) based purely on the quality of its cover art. C.S. Friedman's Coldfire trilogy also had terrific cover art, and that's what got me reading that trilogy. I found G.G.Kay's cover art intriguing, and jumped in for some of that as well.
Min User ID: 9433023	Jun 14th 5:20 PM Here is the specialist for the german covers. The first one is quite bad already, but, yes, labor, the second one is horrible. It actually is by the same "artist" who made the Conan-covers, and the guy on the cover actually looke like Conan. And, sadly, he is not meant to be Tyrion. The guy on the german cover is meant to be either Jon or Robb. Why they should _kill_ wolves, no one will ever understand... but it is so. Cover art _is_ important, and I can tell you why the german ones are so bad. It is the same reason why every GRRM book is split in two (though milking the readers is a strong reason for that, too). Fantasy as a genre is not accepted as a genre for intelligent people at all in germany. I talked with a friend who ownes a fantasy-bookstore in Berlin and actually translates fantasy epics into german. He said that the publishers seem to think that a) german fantasy fans cannot read a book which has more than 200 pages b) just reads books with "Conans" on the cover c) is not interested in a good, literarical use of language, but just in action - which is why most of the fantasy translations are really bad (which, again, is why I always read the books in English). Translaters for fantasy, e.g., are paid not a quarter of the money translaters of other literature get... It really is a pity. But GRRM is lucky still: Robert Jordan's books were each torn into three ot four volumes...
Min User ID: 9433023	Jun 24th 6:55 AM You do not really seem to be interested in the problems of german fantasy readers, are you? ;-)
KAH User ID: 9209903	Jun 24th 8:58 AM I see that you mention translators. Don't get me started on Norwegian translators, it'll be one big rant.
Ser Gary User ID: 8068153	Jun 24th 8:58 AM Who? Oh yeah. I personally like my fantasy books to be big and bold. I'm not sure I'd purchase a fantasy book that was less than 300 pages unless it was HIGHLY recommended.
Min User ID: 9433023	Jun 24th 10:20 AM Are you not reading the Farseers right now? I think each book has not so many pages... there are three of them, though. Btw, I am glad you liked them. Hobb is great, I think.
Ser Gary User ID: 8068153	Jun 24th 10:40 AM The first book is not as big as the other two, but they all go safely past my 300 page minimum. Hobb is a definite talent.
Paula User ID: 9321503	Jun 28th 4:36 PM I mentioned this on the old board, but I really found it interesting so I will mention it again. The US cover of ACOK looks a lot like a painting by EB Leighton called The Accolade. You can see it at the following site: http://www.bmcgaw.com/detail.phtml?catalog_nu=L232 It basically depicts a queen knighting a man, who is kneeling in front of her. Her dress is drawn almost exactly like Meliisandre's and the kneeling man looks just like Davros only in a slightly different position. There are some other similarities but those are the main ones.
Generic Eric User ID: 8339223	Feb 18th 3:59 PM Okay, I hope no one takes me for blind...but I would assume that is Jon on the paperback cover of AGOT?? I don't have AGOT here with me; and I cannot recall Jon's features, yet the sword has a wolf's head pommel, so I guess that would be Jon. Someone help me out--what are Jon's features as described in the book anyway? I can't recall.
KAH User ID: 0541004	Feb 20th 7:05 AM Eric; It's certainly Jon that is depicted (wearing black, followed by a wolf), although he looks far too old. I cannot recall much about Jon's description. Grey eyes, brown hair(I think), slimmer build than Robb.
Ran User ID: 0867924	Feb 20th 8:17 AM That's about it. Shorter than Joffrey, as well, who is very tall for his age apparently.
Generic Eric User ID: 8339223	Feb 20th 10:32 AM Thats what caused me to hesitate--the age factor. He looked way too old to be Jon. But there is no other option really.
Byron User ID: 0798784	Feb 20th 2:34 PM I totally agree...he looked ten years too old to be Jon. I also didn't think he had long hair...does it ever say this in the book? BTW, I heard recently that the UK version of ASOS will have a swordfight(how appropriate), and the US version will have a funeral, both taken from scenes in the book. So, what do you think? Who's the swordfight between? Whose funeral?
Ran User ID: 0867924	Feb 20th 2:42 PM No reference as to hair length, though it seems most men wear their hair to or just off their shoulders. Still, that was too long even for him. As for the discussion of the cover, I thought we had one elsewhere .. For my part, I like to think that the swordfight would be between Gregor and Sandor -- but it might be rather generic. The funeral, who knows. Hoster is like to day in this book. So are, probably, a number of others. I can't see Robb having a nice, calm funeral however.
Dirjj User ID: 6960173	Feb 22nd 2:40 PM Hmm, I have a question (theory) and this theory, if accurate, would make casting for a "fictional" movie, easier. We are basing characters ages on Terran terms. We all know that the seasons are different on the World of ASOI&F, especially on Westeros. But, what if their planet circled the sun at a different rate than our own, and a year to them, is actually a little more than a year to us. Say 1 Terran year is equal to 16 Westeri months. That would make Jon closer to 20, and Bran closer to 12. It would only make Arya 10, but then some of her actions would be more believable. ab
Ran User ID: 0867924	Feb 22nd 3:02 PM On the other hand, it'd make Sansa 16, terribly late to get her period when noble girls tend to get them rather early (because of the overall healthier diets, including a lot more protien and fat and such from meat, I suppose.) It'd also somewhat contradict Martin's statements about 12-14 being seen as 'too young' to give birth to a child in general. While 16 is rather early IRL and there are associated problems with giving early birth, it's at least relatively stable and safe, all in all. I'm not sure they would concern themselves as much as they apparently do if 12 is our 16.