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A Song of Ice and Fire / A Clash of Kings III / Ramsay

Hodor
User ID: 0819174 Jul 4th 7:43 AM
I've read the part where Ramsay burns Winterfell castle.I noticed that he ordered to save the two Freys.Now,Roose Bolton is married to a Frey.So what could this mean?
1-Ramsay holds the Freys as hostages.meaning that Roose Bolton is not a traitor.
2-Ramsay saves the Freys because his father ordered him,meaning that Roose Bolton is a traitor.
There's also a little question about Ramsay's idea about Bran and Rickon.Why did he care how Theon will look if he was going to conquer the castle anyway?

labor
User ID: 0798784 Jul 4th 8:14 AM
IMHO, Ramsay was trying to create a situation that would allow him to leave Winterfell in order to get "help". Hence the heads of the false "Stark kids". In the meantime, he was getting revenge on the people who humilated him (Ser Roderik) or saw him humilated (the miller's family).

I am not sure about the Freys, but it could well be that Little Walder is Roose's brother-in-law. IIRC he has an older sister named Walda. Anyway, I don't see the Bolton garrison supporting Ramsay against Roose.

I am not sure how feasible is the idea of Roose sending any concrete orders concerning Winterfell. I have once calculated that the minimum raven post roundtrip between KL and Winterfell would be about 2 weeks, maximum about 4 weeks and it wouldn't be much less between Harrenhal and Dreadfort.

OTOH, Bolton would have known that Ramsay was alive all this time, because it is unlikely that his people would have mistaked Reek's body for TBOB's. He may have sent some generic orders...
The rub is, we don't know the timing. How do Theon's next-to-last chapter, Arya's last chapter and Theon's last chapter correspond in the timetable? If we knew that, some more definite answers about whether Ramsay could have been acting on Roose's orders could be possible.

Rania
User ID: 9147853 Jul 4th 9:35 AM
Does anyone know which Frey daughter married Roose Bolton?

labor
User ID: 0798784 Jul 4th 10:04 AM
Unfortunately, no. But there are only 2 Waldas of possibly suitable age in the House Frey listing - i.e. the Fair Walda daughter of Walton, Ser Stevron's third son - age not given, but her younger brother is a squire, i.e. at least 11-12. And the Fat Walda, daughter of Merret, a maid of 15 years (in the beginning of ACOK), Little Walder's middle sister.

Rania
User ID: 9147853 Jul 4th 11:17 AM
And if it Fat Walda her mother is a Darry I think.
So who does that leave for Robb? I was trying to compile a list of prospective brides for him.

SPARHAWK THE MIGHTY
User ID: 0436494 Jul 4th 1:30 PM
I THINK IT WAS MANIC-DEPRESSIVE WALDA, OR COULD IT HAVE BEEN COMPULSIVE EATER WALDA?
I'M JUST NOT SURE......

Hodor User ID: 0819174	Jul 4th 7:43 AM I've read the part where Ramsay burns Winterfell castle.I noticed that he ordered to save the two Freys.Now,Roose Bolton is married to a Frey.So what could this mean? 1-Ramsay holds the Freys as hostages.meaning that Roose Bolton is not a traitor. 2-Ramsay saves the Freys because his father ordered him,meaning that Roose Bolton is a traitor. There's also a little question about Ramsay's idea about Bran and Rickon.Why did he care how Theon will look if he was going to conquer the castle anyway?
labor User ID: 0798784	Jul 4th 8:14 AM IMHO, Ramsay was trying to create a situation that would allow him to leave Winterfell in order to get "help". Hence the heads of the false "Stark kids". In the meantime, he was getting revenge on the people who humilated him (Ser Roderik) or saw him humilated (the miller's family). I am not sure about the Freys, but it could well be that Little Walder is Roose's brother-in-law. IIRC he has an older sister named Walda. Anyway, I don't see the Bolton garrison supporting Ramsay against Roose. I am not sure how feasible is the idea of Roose sending any concrete orders concerning Winterfell. I have once calculated that the minimum raven post roundtrip between KL and Winterfell would be about 2 weeks, maximum about 4 weeks and it wouldn't be much less between Harrenhal and Dreadfort. OTOH, Bolton would have known that Ramsay was alive all this time, because it is unlikely that his people would have mistaked Reek's body for TBOB's. He may have sent some generic orders... The rub is, we don't know the timing. How do Theon's next-to-last chapter, Arya's last chapter and Theon's last chapter correspond in the timetable? If we knew that, some more definite answers about whether Ramsay could have been acting on Roose's orders could be possible.
Rania User ID: 9147853	Jul 4th 9:35 AM Does anyone know which Frey daughter married Roose Bolton?
labor User ID: 0798784	Jul 4th 10:04 AM Unfortunately, no. But there are only 2 Waldas of possibly suitable age in the House Frey listing - i.e. the Fair Walda daughter of Walton, Ser Stevron's third son - age not given, but her younger brother is a squire, i.e. at least 11-12. And the Fat Walda, daughter of Merret, a maid of 15 years (in the beginning of ACOK), Little Walder's middle sister.
Rania User ID: 9147853	Jul 4th 11:17 AM And if it Fat Walda her mother is a Darry I think. So who does that leave for Robb? I was trying to compile a list of prospective brides for him.
SPARHAWK THE MIGHTY User ID: 0436494	Jul 4th 1:30 PM I THINK IT WAS MANIC-DEPRESSIVE WALDA, OR COULD IT HAVE BEEN COMPULSIVE EATER WALDA? I'M JUST NOT SURE......