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A Song of Ice and Fire / A Clash of Kings III / Sansa and Loras?

Next 20 Messages

Raistiln
User ID: 1098134 Aug 4th 5:44 PM
I might be way out there but I think that Loras Tyrell rescuing Sansa is a possibility. I see two parallels working here. The first is in AGoT where Loras gives Sansa a red rose during the tournament. That reminds me of where Rhaeger gave Lyanna the blue winter Rose during the tournament.
Next point, Loras became a member of the King's guard without knowing what he is getting into. I see loras as being young, and idealistic, not to mention spoiled, "A child of summer". So I wouldn't be surprised if he eventually is the one to take Joffry's head with a golden sword.

Son of Hot Pie!!!
User ID: 0303694 Aug 4th 6:11 PM
Ah, the romantics on the boards and a Dragonlance name at that. :)

I don't know. I'd like to see that but based on GRRM's writing style he seems to prefer betrayal and arrangements and spited/unreachable love.

But then, maybe it could happen and turn it into a
tragedy?

Aloriana
User ID: 1641184 Aug 4th 7:01 PM
Raistiln, I hope it happens. I don't think Sansa would ever love him. I think it would sort push her to realise that she might belong with the Hound. I think she's grown-up enough to understand that pretty boys aren't always good boys. I think it would be delicious if Loras was in love with Sansa, but she didn't love him, but really wanted to, but couldn't because she felt that she was meant for someone else who will go out of his way to redeem himself because he feels that he is a coward even though she doesn't think that but...I'm really not making sense anymore.

I think it would be a really nifty plot if part of the treaty with High Garden was to marry Sansa to Loras.

Relic
User ID: 9328513 Aug 4th 7:26 PM
The Kingsguard can take no wives.

Padraig
User ID: 1564944 Aug 5th 5:57 AM
I don't think Loras is all that innocent either.

Lannister
User ID: 0770504 Aug 5th 7:41 AM
Wow! That was one impressive run-on sentence Aloriana. You have a real gift there.

Anyway, I think the Lorsa-Sansa match is a possibility.

Aloriana
User ID: 1641184 Aug 5th 12:54 PM
I try, Lannister. =)

The Lannisters have been doing all sorts of things to make things easier for themselves. They may make an exception for Loras and Sansa.

Lodengarl
User ID: 0798784 Aug 7th 9:09 AM
Loras is a homosexual - I think after he has tasted Renly's blade he has no boyish desire to marry young Sansa.

Ants
User ID: 2240694 Aug 7th 9:14 AM
I know a few people have talked about Renly/Loras being homosexual, but what do they base that on?

Lodengarl
User ID: 0798784 Aug 7th 9:19 AM
Some speculative information and stereotypes. Loras and Renly are very close, always together, and Renly forms the "rainbow gaurd" which is a gay stereotype...plus they are both so neat and beautiful and worry about fashion and ornaments, etc. Again, all "gay" stereotypes, but sometimes they can be true. The biggest evidence is Stannis telling Renly that Maergery Tyrell would most likely remain a virgin in Renly's bed, and their marriage was a mummer's farce. Also, when Loras finds out Renly has been killed he sort of reacts like more of a lover than anything - although you can just say he is young and upset because his king was murdered in his camp. Again, a lot of it is speculation and stereotypes, and I think some people, including me, kind of want them to be gay, I think it just adds some more interesting twists to the whole series. Maybe we will never find out :(

Lannister
User ID: 0136334 Aug 7th 10:42 AM
Lodengarl, I picked up on all of that too. I actually think they are both homosexual. This is not a putdown. (Sparhawk, don't bother posting about this please, I beg you). I think it's admirable that GRRM has introduced this element but hasn't made a big deal about it. Some characters, like Stannis, may be homophobic but that is only natural considering the culture that exists. That culture using Medeival Europe as it's template. Now I might be wrong but there are indications that this is case.

Lodengarl
User ID: 0798784 Aug 7th 11:16 AM
I believe they are both homosexual as well, and think it is cool that GRRM introduces that, if in fact, he does...whether we like to pretend all fantasy is heterosexual knights, it is cool that with all of the grit and realism GRRM introduces, he might introduce that as well. If it is true.

Padraig
User ID: 1118614 Aug 8th 3:24 PM
There's also a question mark over whether Margarey is still a virgin. Now that would be a significant pointer if true.

Ran
User ID: 0867924 Aug 8th 3:59 PM
Not really, given GRRM's statements. 16 is, according to the maesters, the earliest safe age a bride should be at before you impregnate her -- though mid-late 15 is of course close enough that some might argue there's no difference.

One could in any case argue that Renly was so certain of his victory, and so wary of any sort of danger to Margaery, that he had strong reasons not to feel at a rush.

A weak enough argument, maybe, but I think it seriously weakens the importance of the virginity matter.

Aloriana
User ID: 1641184 Aug 8th 6:13 PM
Ok, maybe I'm the naive type but I didn't pick up on Loras being homosexual. I thought he was just a misguided idealist. I have got some re-reading to do, I'll admit, but I really don't agree that Loras is homosexual.

Lommy
User ID: 0262034 Aug 9th 0:18 AM
Both Renly and Loras are gay, and i think most of the characters in the book seem to be aware of it, they just seem to not really care that much. Of course a character like Sansa dosent see it, but Sansa dosent really see anything,she still just a pretty little bird, with visions of fairy tales in her head. GRRM might write fantasy, but he dont do fairy tales.

Relic
User ID: 9328513 Aug 9th 2:33 AM
Aloriana, what is your statement about Loras being a mis-guided idealist based on?

Aloriana
User ID: 1641184 Aug 10th 5:01 PM
Relic, It was more of an impression I had. The way he gave the flower to Sansa when he won the tournament. The way he seems to follow people who talk pretty things and make heroic gestures, such as the Rainbow Knights or whatever they're called. Like I said, I still need to reread, but I never saw the homosexuality or even had the idea.

Padraig
User ID: 2107894 Aug 11th 1:12 PM
Ran, i'd certainly argue that her age makes no difference;-)

There was no proof in aCoK. But there was enough hints to make me very suspicious.

Weasel
User ID: 2630464 Aug 11th 5:41 PM
The strongest indication I had was when Stannis told his brother that his wife was likely to stay a maiden in his bed.
After that, I just sorta assumed it was Renly and the pretty-boy, Loras.

Next 20 Messages

Raistiln User ID: 1098134	Aug 4th 5:44 PM I might be way out there but I think that Loras Tyrell rescuing Sansa is a possibility. I see two parallels working here. The first is in AGoT where Loras gives Sansa a red rose during the tournament. That reminds me of where Rhaeger gave Lyanna the blue winter Rose during the tournament. Next point, Loras became a member of the King's guard without knowing what he is getting into. I see loras as being young, and idealistic, not to mention spoiled, "A child of summer". So I wouldn't be surprised if he eventually is the one to take Joffry's head with a golden sword.
Son of Hot Pie!!! User ID: 0303694	Aug 4th 6:11 PM Ah, the romantics on the boards and a Dragonlance name at that. :) I don't know. I'd like to see that but based on GRRM's writing style he seems to prefer betrayal and arrangements and spited/unreachable love. But then, maybe it could happen and turn it into a tragedy?
Aloriana User ID: 1641184	Aug 4th 7:01 PM Raistiln, I hope it happens. I don't think Sansa would ever love him. I think it would sort push her to realise that she might belong with the Hound. I think she's grown-up enough to understand that pretty boys aren't always good boys. I think it would be delicious if Loras was in love with Sansa, but she didn't love him, but really wanted to, but couldn't because she felt that she was meant for someone else who will go out of his way to redeem himself because he feels that he is a coward even though she doesn't think that but...I'm really not making sense anymore. I think it would be a really nifty plot if part of the treaty with High Garden was to marry Sansa to Loras.
Relic User ID: 9328513	Aug 4th 7:26 PM The Kingsguard can take no wives.
Padraig User ID: 1564944	Aug 5th 5:57 AM I don't think Loras is all that innocent either.
Lannister User ID: 0770504	Aug 5th 7:41 AM Wow! That was one impressive run-on sentence Aloriana. You have a real gift there. Anyway, I think the Lorsa-Sansa match is a possibility.
Aloriana User ID: 1641184	Aug 5th 12:54 PM I try, Lannister. =) The Lannisters have been doing all sorts of things to make things easier for themselves. They may make an exception for Loras and Sansa.
Lodengarl User ID: 0798784	Aug 7th 9:09 AM Loras is a homosexual - I think after he has tasted Renly's blade he has no boyish desire to marry young Sansa.
Ants User ID: 2240694	Aug 7th 9:14 AM I know a few people have talked about Renly/Loras being homosexual, but what do they base that on?
Lodengarl User ID: 0798784	Aug 7th 9:19 AM Some speculative information and stereotypes. Loras and Renly are very close, always together, and Renly forms the "rainbow gaurd" which is a gay stereotype...plus they are both so neat and beautiful and worry about fashion and ornaments, etc. Again, all "gay" stereotypes, but sometimes they can be true. The biggest evidence is Stannis telling Renly that Maergery Tyrell would most likely remain a virgin in Renly's bed, and their marriage was a mummer's farce. Also, when Loras finds out Renly has been killed he sort of reacts like more of a lover than anything - although you can just say he is young and upset because his king was murdered in his camp. Again, a lot of it is speculation and stereotypes, and I think some people, including me, kind of want them to be gay, I think it just adds some more interesting twists to the whole series. Maybe we will never find out :(
Lannister User ID: 0136334	Aug 7th 10:42 AM Lodengarl, I picked up on all of that too. I actually think they are both homosexual. This is not a putdown. (Sparhawk, don't bother posting about this please, I beg you). I think it's admirable that GRRM has introduced this element but hasn't made a big deal about it. Some characters, like Stannis, may be homophobic but that is only natural considering the culture that exists. That culture using Medeival Europe as it's template. Now I might be wrong but there are indications that this is case.
Lodengarl User ID: 0798784	Aug 7th 11:16 AM I believe they are both homosexual as well, and think it is cool that GRRM introduces that, if in fact, he does...whether we like to pretend all fantasy is heterosexual knights, it is cool that with all of the grit and realism GRRM introduces, he might introduce that as well. If it is true.
Padraig User ID: 1118614	Aug 8th 3:24 PM There's also a question mark over whether Margarey is still a virgin. Now that would be a significant pointer if true.
Ran User ID: 0867924	Aug 8th 3:59 PM Not really, given GRRM's statements. 16 is, according to the maesters, the earliest safe age a bride should be at before you impregnate her -- though mid-late 15 is of course close enough that some might argue there's no difference. One could in any case argue that Renly was so certain of his victory, and so wary of any sort of danger to Margaery, that he had strong reasons not to feel at a rush. A weak enough argument, maybe, but I think it seriously weakens the importance of the virginity matter.
Aloriana User ID: 1641184	Aug 8th 6:13 PM Ok, maybe I'm the naive type but I didn't pick up on Loras being homosexual. I thought he was just a misguided idealist. I have got some re-reading to do, I'll admit, but I really don't agree that Loras is homosexual.
Lommy User ID: 0262034	Aug 9th 0:18 AM Both Renly and Loras are gay, and i think most of the characters in the book seem to be aware of it, they just seem to not really care that much. Of course a character like Sansa dosent see it, but Sansa dosent really see anything,she still just a pretty little bird, with visions of fairy tales in her head. GRRM might write fantasy, but he dont do fairy tales.
Relic User ID: 9328513	Aug 9th 2:33 AM Aloriana, what is your statement about Loras being a mis-guided idealist based on?
Aloriana User ID: 1641184	Aug 10th 5:01 PM Relic, It was more of an impression I had. The way he gave the flower to Sansa when he won the tournament. The way he seems to follow people who talk pretty things and make heroic gestures, such as the Rainbow Knights or whatever they're called. Like I said, I still need to reread, but I never saw the homosexuality or even had the idea.
Padraig User ID: 2107894	Aug 11th 1:12 PM Ran, i'd certainly argue that her age makes no difference;-) There was no proof in aCoK. But there was enough hints to make me very suspicious.
Weasel User ID: 2630464	Aug 11th 5:41 PM The strongest indication I had was when Stannis told his brother that his wife was likely to stay a maiden in his bed. After that, I just sorta assumed it was Renly and the pretty-boy, Loras.