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A Song of Ice and Fire / A Clash of Kings II / The Attempted Assassination of Bran IV

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Jeff
User ID: 1536664 May 10th 2:33 PM
Well, the last thread is full, and I've no time to transfer messages. So I'll just go right to my response to labor's point about Robert as the culprit.

Finally! Someone else who suspects Robert! thank you, thank you. Now if we're also right about the Red Fork being a feint, we'll be all set. :-)

labor, I also agree that maybe Robert is a bit less pleasant than many of us have assumed. We see him a bit through Ned's eyes and maybe that's why he have some sympathy or affection for him. He reminds me a bit of Ralph Kramden, or maybe Fred Flintstone. But in terms of his "good" qualities, I don't know. Had he not had Ned's influence, he might have been a truly wretched individual.

Padraig, I think Robert hoped that Ned would never find out.

Actually, that raises an interesting point. Did Robert have any way of knowing whether his little scheme to kill Bran succeeded or failed? Neither the attempt nor Bran's death was ever public knowledge.

Perhaps that's the reason Robert never "confessed" on his deathbed -- he just didn't know what had happened. If someone tried to kill Bran but failed, Robert would have expected to hear something about it from Ned. Or if the attempt was successful, Robert also would have expected to hear something from Ned about it. But to Robert, hearing _nothing at all_ about an attempt on Bran's life was very, very strange. Inexplicable, really. Unless...

Maybe he thought the assassin just chickened out and ran off with the knife and money. That seems to be the most plausible explanation from Robert's perspective, because otherwise, he _surely_ would have heard something from Ned.
So, why "confess" to an attempt that was never made?

Had Ned told Robert what had happened, it would be more reasonable to expect a deathbed confession. But as things stand now, there must have been a real question in Robert's mind as to whether anything had happened at all. For all Robert knew, a deathbed confession to Ned might have elicited nothing more than a "what the Hell are you talking about, Robert? No one tried to kill my son with a knife."

No crime, no confession.

sparhawk
User ID: 0436494 May 10th 2:47 PM
ballsology!!!!!!
no way did robert try to have bran killed!
why would he??? surely he knew that if ned found out, he'd kill him.
robert knew he had few enough true allies as it was. many still saw him as the usurper, his own wife and her family hated him - ned was , as robert said himself, the only true friend left to him, the only one courageous to tell the truth, and not be a 'yes man'.
you can justify the fact that robert was capable of something like that by the way he tried to get dany assassinated, but you must bear in mind, jeff, that his hatred of the targaryen's was all consuming, because of what had happened to lyanna, his one true love.
you can also justify his refusal to accept that it was an evil thing to kill the targaryen children, but look at it this way: how many millions of lives might have been saved if hitler had been killed as a child?

i'm going back thesis-typing now.

Ran
User ID: 0867924 May 10th 2:50 PM
You know, just noticed something -- Ned's been wearing that knife the entire bloody time he was at KL. I recalled, definently, that he put it on just before he goes see Robert on his death bed. And of course he has it in the throne room. But after his argument with Robert and the council, I found that he was wearing it, and see no reason to presume he wasn't wearing it before.

Maybe it doesn't mean much, but I think it takes some wind out of the sails of the idea that the person behind it wasn't perhaps aware of the fact that Ned actually had the knife, just by noticing the thing on his belt.

As for Robert not being a nice guy -- in some ways, he was. Open-hearted, generous, charismatic in his heyday, courageous (though to the point of fool hardiness). But he wasn't a good king, in fact he was rather bad, and the fact that his relationship with Cersei more or less unmanned him and he had that Targaryen madness ... well, it makes him be a deeply flawed figure.

Yet, because those two particular things -- being bullied by Cersei and despising Targaryens -- are directly involved in what happened to Mycah and maybe the bastards being killed (though we really don't know for certain if Littlefinger's tale is true, or -- if true -- if Robert is actually aware of it) and how Robert felt about Targaryen children, I wonder how they apply in the case of Bran?

Unless one wants to theorize that Cersei bullied Robert into carrying out the plan?

labor
User ID: 0798784 May 10th 3:27 PM
We will prevail, Jeff! I recently looked into "Red Fork" theory and the only point which doesn't allow the solid proof is that we don't know how many days passed between the arrival of Stannis's troops and arrival of his ships. Yes, and confirmation that he moved on to KL immediately after Storm End's fall would be nice. The Lannister troops began their retreat from Red Fork 8-11 days after the Fall of Storm's End, BTW.

Back to Robert - I am sure that he knew that Bran woke up eventually. That info went through Pycelle, after all and the Starks spent a thanksgiving vigil in the godswood. So, hearing nothing about the assault he very well could have assumed that the assassin thought better of it. As to dagger being worn by Ned - Robert hardly is the most perceptive guy. IMHO he just didn't notice.

I don't see Robert as truly generous and open-hearted.IMHO it is quite significant that he has no friends but Jon and Ned. What makes Robert especially repellent to me is his womanizing and complete disregard for resulting bastards. I mean, Robert's women really fell in love with him, he made promises to them and then he just abandoned them without a second thought, not even providing a clipped copper for the bastards (despite what tradition declares)! This is quite base, IMHO. All in all Robert is IMHO a complete egotist and egoist as is evident from his (mis)rule and his relations with Ned.

Ran
User ID: 0867924 May 10th 3:30 PM
King's often don't have friends, in general. However, before that . . .

Ned says that Barristan Selmy cut down a dozen good men at the Green Fork, both his and Robert's. So, yeah, Robert had friends. War and kingship no doubt struck a heavy toll for those friends, and the the growing domestic troubles made things all the worse. I'm sure Cersei drove away most anyone who tried to become a friend of Robert's.

Rughead
User ID: 9627953 May 10th 4:03 PM
Ran, thank you for reminding me of the Tyrion narrative, contemplating a conspirator while in the Vale, that you posted on the previous "Bran" thread.

It is precisely the point where I was prompted to consider alternatives, and those alternatives led to Littlefinger, and why GUCT became so appealing.

labor, where do I find the "Red Fork" theory?

labor
User ID: 0798784 May 10th 5:15 PM
The "feint on the Red Fork" theory was mainly discussed at the "A Clash of Kings" board in the thread "Robb and Tywin".

The only addition I can confidently make is that:

It took a raven _6_ days to reach KL after the debacle at Oxcross. Even if they didn't have any ravens with them and had to ride as far as Lannisport to sent some (no castles on the way?), "not 3 days ride" from Oxcross, that would mean that the raven needed at least 3 days to cover the distance between Lannisport and KL. The distance between Storm's End and Riverrun is about 20% longer. Thus the raven would also need something between 3 and 6 days to cover it.

And after Catelyn received the letter, fighting at the ford went on for 5-6 days more.

Thus the Lannister host started from the Red Fork 8-11 days after the fall of Storm's End.

Jeff
User ID: 8813033 May 10th 6:35 PM
As for Robert noticing the dagger -- there's no telling how much of it was exposed, whether it was covered up by Ned's tunic, etc. And if it was sheathed, even less would be visible.

Ran
User ID: 0867924 May 10th 6:41 PM
Yet Tyrion had no problem noticing it when Littlefinger wore it. I find the idea of a tunic covering it odd -- one generally wore the belt over the tunic, one way or another, to make the knife accessible. Certainly, while sitting a tunic might fold and obscure things, but completely covering?

In any case, just noting Ned was wearing it, and that someone who bothered to glance his way might notice a black dragonbone hilt for the dagger. Whether Robert did or not is unknowable, but still -- if Ned was in the habit to wear it at council meetings, Robert got plenty of opportunity.

Moreta
User ID: 0701364 May 10th 6:58 PM
Littlefinger used Cersei to send the assassin.

Or maybe we've been looking at it all wrong. Let's see, there's the prime three suspects: Littlefinger, Robert, and Cersei. It could be all the three working together :)

I know I'm not thinking straight but hey, anything goes.

Hot Pie
User ID: 2700404 May 10th 7:22 PM
this is silly but has anyone thought that maybe Lyssa had sent the man. So to truely make her believe the letter that she sent

wondering.....HOT PIE!!!!!!

KAH
User ID: 0541004 May 11th 8:18 AM
Seeing as twenty-odd messages in this thread has passed without a comment on my part, I must make up for it... :P

The main reason for me thinking that Robert being behind it is out of character for him, is not that he'd be loath to kill a child...I think he could do so, if the motivations was right (i.e. Targaryen child or finding out about the incest).

It would, however, be out of character because it would be _backstabbing_, however much you turn it around, and I don't think Robert could have rationalized that away. This is the one thing that Robert cannot forgive (according to Ned), so I doubt that he'd do such a thing himself.

Sure, he might personally think it would be best for the Starks if Bran died, but it would still be going behind Ned's back. The fact that he did not mention it to Ned in any way beforehand shows this clearly - if he could not make himself talk to Ned about it, the only reason for that would be that he knew how Ned would react.
Doing the misdeed anyway, then, consequently amounts to backstabbing.

Blackstone
User ID: 9858163 May 11th 2:40 PM
I think Robert was behind it and I think that he thought that he was doing Ned a favor.

Yes, a favor.

Robert is a man of action in an age where the nobility don't share our values regarding the sanctity of life -- that even Bran's life was worth living. A life of a cripple is no life. A life as a fat coward is no life.

Seeing Bran suffer, and Ned suffer for it, Robert endeavored to do, what he knew Ned could never do, end Bran's suffering. Was it backstabbing -- not really, even if you believed it had to be done, that it was the right thing to do, its not the sort of thing you can ask from someone or confess on your deathbead.

Ran
User ID: 0867924 May 11th 2:45 PM
Yet Robert gave up the ghost when he finally confessed his madness concerning Targaryens was wrong -- and that hatred was a deep, undying one that had had a hold on him for some fifteen years.
If he can confess his mistake there, I'd certainly think he could and would confess to Ned that he tried to take matters into his own hands, for reasons he saw as good.

Jeff
User ID: 1536664 May 11th 5:29 PM
Kay-Arne, I think your criticism is valid. But I do think the story about Stannis and the hawk is really a tip as to Robert's motives.

Ran, the difference is that Ned knew about the attempt to kill the missing Targaryens. Robert had fired him over it, and wanted to apologise to Ned and tell Ned he was right.

But as I said above, Robert may very well have believed that the attempt was never carried out, and that it was a dead issue. No reason to say anything to Ned because Ned wasn't even aware of the attempt in the first place. No harm, no foul.

Ran
User ID: 0867924 May 11th 6:03 PM
Except Robert knows he did something wrong, no matter what became of it. Would he see it as "no harm, no foul" on his very death bed, when he wants to make a clean sweep of things? I don't think so, myself. Just as I don't find the thing with a hawk a tip off.

I think it's inevitable that characterization become a stumbling block in a case like this. People take things differently when it comes to characterization

labor
User ID: 0798784 May 12th 5:52 AM
I don't see were this idea that Robert should confess all his sins on the deathbed comes from. Yes, he wanted to take the order concerning Dany's assassination back, but that was an action in progress.
_And_ Robert being savaged by the boar very soon after he sent assassins after Dany seemed very suggestive. A sign of the gods, if you will, especially considering that Robert did initially go to hunt a _white hart_.

We never see Robert confessing his other misdeeds (i.e. abandoned bastards, etc), or maybe change his view on the death of Rhaegar's children.

He speaks solely about the things that can still be salvaged, i.e. Dany's assassination and his poor rule of the realm. Also, Robert says that he was as bad a king as Aerys. Why? Maybe that's your hint that he did send an assassin after Bran.

Anyway, I see no suggestion in Robert's death scene that he would have necessarily told Ned all of his past sins, which didn't (in his opinion) have any reprecussions on the present.

It is, BTW, somewhat curious, IMHO that Robert wasn't attended by a septon.

Ran
User ID: 0867924 May 12th 5:58 AM
A clean sweep of things with _Ned_ -- part of the reason for admitting his mistake with Ned is because it was a huge argument between the two, that caused a rift between them. Trying to have Bran killed, the very thought of it, is something Ned should be told. I think Robert would have fessed up to it, but that's me.

The thing about being as bad as Aerys was Robert being rather self-depreciating. It's a stretch to call _that_ a hint, since what Aerys did was torture and murder adults, not murdering children.

I suspect Robert would get the septon after Ned left -- they probably wanted to keep it as quiet as possible, perhaps at Robert's own command, until he could talk to Ned.

Jeff
User ID: 1536664 May 12th 8:01 AM
Nice point, labor. If I'm laying on my deathbed, and I cheated on my wife but she never found out, why would I ever tell her? To give her another emotional blow? Some secrets are best taken to the grave.

Aaron
User ID: 0115944 May 12th 8:55 AM
What are Roberts motives in sending an assassin for Bran? I can think of only two. The first, and slightly less believable IMHO, is that he wanted to spare Bran from the life of a cripple. A mercy killing. Second theory would be that Robert knew about Cersei and Jaime and did not want that shameful secret uncovered. But why should the Lannisters incestuous relationship cause him to worry? Unless he was being blackmailed somehow... or was in bed with the Lannister powers for some reason.

I like the idea of Robert being at fault for Brans attempted assassination. However, if it was true that Robert was behind the plot... how would it affect the story? I mean, nobody except Ned was very close to Robert so the emotional impact upon whichever POV found out would be minimal. (Although it would be an interesting tidbit for the reader.) Plus, with Robert dead and gone who could the Starks take revenge on? If Robert was behind this scheme then the issue seems to be of little consequence.

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Jeff User ID: 1536664	May 10th 2:33 PM Well, the last thread is full, and I've no time to transfer messages. So I'll just go right to my response to labor's point about Robert as the culprit. Finally! Someone else who suspects Robert! thank you, thank you. Now if we're also right about the Red Fork being a feint, we'll be all set. :-) labor, I also agree that maybe Robert is a bit less pleasant than many of us have assumed. We see him a bit through Ned's eyes and maybe that's why he have some sympathy or affection for him. He reminds me a bit of Ralph Kramden, or maybe Fred Flintstone. But in terms of his "good" qualities, I don't know. Had he not had Ned's influence, he might have been a truly wretched individual. Padraig, I think Robert hoped that Ned would never find out. Actually, that raises an interesting point. Did Robert have any way of knowing whether his little scheme to kill Bran succeeded or failed? Neither the attempt nor Bran's death was ever public knowledge. Perhaps that's the reason Robert never "confessed" on his deathbed -- he just didn't know what had happened. If someone tried to kill Bran but failed, Robert would have expected to hear something about it from Ned. Or if the attempt was successful, Robert also would have expected to hear something from Ned about it. But to Robert, hearing _nothing at all_ about an attempt on Bran's life was very, very strange. Inexplicable, really. Unless... Maybe he thought the assassin just chickened out and ran off with the knife and money. That seems to be the most plausible explanation from Robert's perspective, because otherwise, he _surely_ would have heard something from Ned. So, why "confess" to an attempt that was never made? Had Ned told Robert what had happened, it would be more reasonable to expect a deathbed confession. But as things stand now, there must have been a real question in Robert's mind as to whether anything had happened at all. For all Robert knew, a deathbed confession to Ned might have elicited nothing more than a "what the Hell are you talking about, Robert? No one tried to kill my son with a knife." No crime, no confession.
sparhawk User ID: 0436494	May 10th 2:47 PM ballsology!!!!!! no way did robert try to have bran killed! why would he??? surely he knew that if ned found out, he'd kill him. robert knew he had few enough true allies as it was. many still saw him as the usurper, his own wife and her family hated him - ned was , as robert said himself, the only true friend left to him, the only one courageous to tell the truth, and not be a 'yes man'. you can justify the fact that robert was capable of something like that by the way he tried to get dany assassinated, but you must bear in mind, jeff, that his hatred of the targaryen's was all consuming, because of what had happened to lyanna, his one true love. you can also justify his refusal to accept that it was an evil thing to kill the targaryen children, but look at it this way: how many millions of lives might have been saved if hitler had been killed as a child? i'm going back thesis-typing now.
Ran User ID: 0867924	May 10th 2:50 PM You know, just noticed something -- Ned's been wearing that knife the entire bloody time he was at KL. I recalled, definently, that he put it on just before he goes see Robert on his death bed. And of course he has it in the throne room. But after his argument with Robert and the council, I found that he was wearing it, and see no reason to presume he wasn't wearing it before. Maybe it doesn't mean much, but I think it takes some wind out of the sails of the idea that the person behind it wasn't perhaps aware of the fact that Ned actually had the knife, just by noticing the thing on his belt. As for Robert not being a nice guy -- in some ways, he was. Open-hearted, generous, charismatic in his heyday, courageous (though to the point of fool hardiness). But he wasn't a good king, in fact he was rather bad, and the fact that his relationship with Cersei more or less unmanned him and he had that Targaryen madness ... well, it makes him be a deeply flawed figure. Yet, because those two particular things -- being bullied by Cersei and despising Targaryens -- are directly involved in what happened to Mycah and maybe the bastards being killed (though we really don't know for certain if Littlefinger's tale is true, or -- if true -- if Robert is actually aware of it) and how Robert felt about Targaryen children, I wonder how they apply in the case of Bran? Unless one wants to theorize that Cersei bullied Robert into carrying out the plan?
labor User ID: 0798784	May 10th 3:27 PM We will prevail, Jeff! I recently looked into "Red Fork" theory and the only point which doesn't allow the solid proof is that we don't know how many days passed between the arrival of Stannis's troops and arrival of his ships. Yes, and confirmation that he moved on to KL immediately after Storm End's fall would be nice. The Lannister troops began their retreat from Red Fork 8-11 days after the Fall of Storm's End, BTW. Back to Robert - I am sure that he knew that Bran woke up eventually. That info went through Pycelle, after all and the Starks spent a thanksgiving vigil in the godswood. So, hearing nothing about the assault he very well could have assumed that the assassin thought better of it. As to dagger being worn by Ned - Robert hardly is the most perceptive guy. IMHO he just didn't notice. I don't see Robert as truly generous and open-hearted.IMHO it is quite significant that he has no friends but Jon and Ned. What makes Robert especially repellent to me is his womanizing and complete disregard for resulting bastards. I mean, Robert's women really fell in love with him, he made promises to them and then he just abandoned them without a second thought, not even providing a clipped copper for the bastards (despite what tradition declares)! This is quite base, IMHO. All in all Robert is IMHO a complete egotist and egoist as is evident from his (mis)rule and his relations with Ned.
Ran User ID: 0867924	May 10th 3:30 PM King's often don't have friends, in general. However, before that . . . Ned says that Barristan Selmy cut down a dozen good men at the Green Fork, both his and Robert's. So, yeah, Robert had friends. War and kingship no doubt struck a heavy toll for those friends, and the the growing domestic troubles made things all the worse. I'm sure Cersei drove away most anyone who tried to become a friend of Robert's.
Rughead User ID: 9627953	May 10th 4:03 PM Ran, thank you for reminding me of the Tyrion narrative, contemplating a conspirator while in the Vale, that you posted on the previous "Bran" thread. It is precisely the point where I was prompted to consider alternatives, and those alternatives led to Littlefinger, and why GUCT became so appealing. labor, where do I find the "Red Fork" theory?
labor User ID: 0798784	May 10th 5:15 PM The "feint on the Red Fork" theory was mainly discussed at the "A Clash of Kings" board in the thread "Robb and Tywin". The only addition I can confidently make is that: It took a raven _6_ days to reach KL after the debacle at Oxcross. Even if they didn't have any ravens with them and had to ride as far as Lannisport to sent some (no castles on the way?), "not 3 days ride" from Oxcross, that would mean that the raven needed at least 3 days to cover the distance between Lannisport and KL. The distance between Storm's End and Riverrun is about 20% longer. Thus the raven would also need something between 3 and 6 days to cover it. And after Catelyn received the letter, fighting at the ford went on for 5-6 days more. Thus the Lannister host started from the Red Fork 8-11 days after the fall of Storm's End.
Jeff User ID: 8813033	May 10th 6:35 PM As for Robert noticing the dagger -- there's no telling how much of it was exposed, whether it was covered up by Ned's tunic, etc. And if it was sheathed, even less would be visible.
Ran User ID: 0867924	May 10th 6:41 PM Yet Tyrion had no problem noticing it when Littlefinger wore it. I find the idea of a tunic covering it odd -- one generally wore the belt over the tunic, one way or another, to make the knife accessible. Certainly, while sitting a tunic might fold and obscure things, but completely covering? In any case, just noting Ned was wearing it, and that someone who bothered to glance his way might notice a black dragonbone hilt for the dagger. Whether Robert did or not is unknowable, but still -- if Ned was in the habit to wear it at council meetings, Robert got plenty of opportunity.
Moreta User ID: 0701364	May 10th 6:58 PM Littlefinger used Cersei to send the assassin. Or maybe we've been looking at it all wrong. Let's see, there's the prime three suspects: Littlefinger, Robert, and Cersei. It could be all the three working together :) I know I'm not thinking straight but hey, anything goes.
Hot Pie User ID: 2700404	May 10th 7:22 PM this is silly but has anyone thought that maybe Lyssa had sent the man. So to truely make her believe the letter that she sent wondering.....HOT PIE!!!!!!
KAH User ID: 0541004	May 11th 8:18 AM Seeing as twenty-odd messages in this thread has passed without a comment on my part, I must make up for it... :P The main reason for me thinking that Robert being behind it is out of character for him, is not that he'd be loath to kill a child...I think he could do so, if the motivations was right (i.e. Targaryen child or finding out about the incest). It would, however, be out of character because it would be _backstabbing_, however much you turn it around, and I don't think Robert could have rationalized that away. This is the one thing that Robert cannot forgive (according to Ned), so I doubt that he'd do such a thing himself. Sure, he might personally think it would be best for the Starks if Bran died, but it would still be going behind Ned's back. The fact that he did not mention it to Ned in any way beforehand shows this clearly - if he could not make himself talk to Ned about it, the only reason for that would be that he knew how Ned would react. Doing the misdeed anyway, then, consequently amounts to backstabbing.
Blackstone User ID: 9858163	May 11th 2:40 PM I think Robert was behind it and I think that he thought that he was doing Ned a favor. Yes, a favor. Robert is a man of action in an age where the nobility don't share our values regarding the sanctity of life -- that even Bran's life was worth living. A life of a cripple is no life. A life as a fat coward is no life. Seeing Bran suffer, and Ned suffer for it, Robert endeavored to do, what he knew Ned could never do, end Bran's suffering. Was it backstabbing -- not really, even if you believed it had to be done, that it was the right thing to do, its not the sort of thing you can ask from someone or confess on your deathbead.
Ran User ID: 0867924	May 11th 2:45 PM Yet Robert gave up the ghost when he finally confessed his madness concerning Targaryens was wrong -- and that hatred was a deep, undying one that had had a hold on him for some fifteen years. If he can confess his mistake there, I'd certainly think he could and would confess to Ned that he tried to take matters into his own hands, for reasons he saw as good.
Jeff User ID: 1536664	May 11th 5:29 PM Kay-Arne, I think your criticism is valid. But I do think the story about Stannis and the hawk is really a tip as to Robert's motives. Ran, the difference is that Ned knew about the attempt to kill the missing Targaryens. Robert had fired him over it, and wanted to apologise to Ned and tell Ned he was right. But as I said above, Robert may very well have believed that the attempt was never carried out, and that it was a dead issue. No reason to say anything to Ned because Ned wasn't even aware of the attempt in the first place. No harm, no foul.
Ran User ID: 0867924	May 11th 6:03 PM Except Robert knows he did something wrong, no matter what became of it. Would he see it as "no harm, no foul" on his very death bed, when he wants to make a clean sweep of things? I don't think so, myself. Just as I don't find the thing with a hawk a tip off. I think it's inevitable that characterization become a stumbling block in a case like this. People take things differently when it comes to characterization
labor User ID: 0798784	May 12th 5:52 AM I don't see were this idea that Robert should confess all his sins on the deathbed comes from. Yes, he wanted to take the order concerning Dany's assassination back, but that was an action in progress. _And_ Robert being savaged by the boar very soon after he sent assassins after Dany seemed very suggestive. A sign of the gods, if you will, especially considering that Robert did initially go to hunt a _white hart_. We never see Robert confessing his other misdeeds (i.e. abandoned bastards, etc), or maybe change his view on the death of Rhaegar's children. He speaks solely about the things that can still be salvaged, i.e. Dany's assassination and his poor rule of the realm. Also, Robert says that he was as bad a king as Aerys. Why? Maybe that's your hint that he did send an assassin after Bran. Anyway, I see no suggestion in Robert's death scene that he would have necessarily told Ned all of his past sins, which didn't (in his opinion) have any reprecussions on the present. It is, BTW, somewhat curious, IMHO that Robert wasn't attended by a septon.
Ran User ID: 0867924	May 12th 5:58 AM A clean sweep of things with _Ned_ -- part of the reason for admitting his mistake with Ned is because it was a huge argument between the two, that caused a rift between them. Trying to have Bran killed, the very thought of it, is something Ned should be told. I think Robert would have fessed up to it, but that's me. The thing about being as bad as Aerys was Robert being rather self-depreciating. It's a stretch to call _that_ a hint, since what Aerys did was torture and murder adults, not murdering children. I suspect Robert would get the septon after Ned left -- they probably wanted to keep it as quiet as possible, perhaps at Robert's own command, until he could talk to Ned.
Jeff User ID: 1536664	May 12th 8:01 AM Nice point, labor. If I'm laying on my deathbed, and I cheated on my wife but she never found out, why would I ever tell her? To give her another emotional blow? Some secrets are best taken to the grave.
Aaron User ID: 0115944	May 12th 8:55 AM What are Roberts motives in sending an assassin for Bran? I can think of only two. The first, and slightly less believable IMHO, is that he wanted to spare Bran from the life of a cripple. A mercy killing. Second theory would be that Robert knew about Cersei and Jaime and did not want that shameful secret uncovered. But why should the Lannisters incestuous relationship cause him to worry? Unless he was being blackmailed somehow... or was in bed with the Lannister powers for some reason. I like the idea of Robert being at fault for Brans attempted assassination. However, if it was true that Robert was behind the plot... how would it affect the story? I mean, nobody except Ned was very close to Robert so the emotional impact upon whichever POV found out would be minimal. (Although it would be an interesting tidbit for the reader.) Plus, with Robert dead and gone who could the Starks take revenge on? If Robert was behind this scheme then the issue seems to be of little consequence.