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A Song of Ice and Fire / A Song of Ice and Fire / Re-read Observation #1

Lodengarl
User ID: 0798784 Jun 14th 8:58 AM
A couple things I found interesting in my latest re-read of A Game of Thrones.

1) The King's procession traveled from King's Landing, to Casterly Rock, then to Winterfell - this is mentioned very, very briefly in Tyrion's chapter where he is traveling north with Jon and Ben. I never realized this before...not sure what to make of it, just interesting.

2) In the same paragraph and chapter, Tyrion mentions to Jon that he took some rare volumes from the Winterfell Library with the Stark's permission. The very next chapter the library is set on fire in the attempted assassination of Bran. I thought that was a cool, interesting point. Purely coincidental? Possible GRRM throwing us off by putting that in? Possibly. Possible clue that Tyrion wanted Bran dead (did not want to lose some volumes in the library fire), possible. It probably means nothing, but is still interesting to speculate on.

Ser Gary
User ID: 1523284 Jun 14th 9:30 AM
Someone (maybe it was Min) had once speculated on the possibility that Tyrion was responsible for the attempt on Bran's life. Many people here simply dismissed the notion, given Tyrion's supposed nature and several other rationalizations which escape me now.

Let me just throw out this question: Why might Tyrion want Bran dead?

Lodengarl
User ID: 0798784 Jun 14th 9:36 AM
The only reason is that he is a true Lannister and does love his family...we must realize that he is truly a Lannister and would do anything for his family..maybe Jaime asked him to do his dirty work for him, or maybe Tyrion knew (if you recall the chapter before Tyrion guesses Cersei and Jaime were caught and threw Bran out) and wanted to end it before accusations came out which would harm his family...remember, if Robert did find out he would throw the Lannisters out on their asses...maybe Tyrion, always being dutiful to his family decided to end Bran's life for the good of the family.

Ser Gary
User ID: 1523284 Jun 14th 9:51 AM
...and if Tyrion's family goes down, Tyrion starts looking for a job with the circus as opposed to using his smarts to further his political ambitions.

Ran
User ID: 0867924 Jun 14th 11:10 AM
Gary,

The reason it isn't Tyrion is simple -- check the scene in the sky cells. His own thoughts reveal that he wasn't the one behind it, because he was trying to figure out which of his siblings had ordered it.

Unless one wants to go with a dual personality type thing, I can't see how Tyrion could be the one behind it, given that.

BTW, Lodengarl, I don't believe the king's party went to Casterly Rock first. I'm presuming that you mean the bit where Tyrion thinks of having brought a wine all the way north from Casterly Rock -- which doesn't say too much. As far as I recall, he wasn't actually in KL at the time of Robert's departure, and may have ridden out from the Rock to join his siblings after learning of it.

Or, alternatively, the bottle of wine had been acquired in Casterly Rock, he had kept it when he went to KL, and from there went to the North. If there's something that specifically says the king went to Casterly Rock first -- and I can't see as he would have, given that he had a long enough trip as it was -- I can't find it, though I've skimmed.

Lodengarl
User ID: 0798784 Jun 14th 11:16 AM
Ran, you are right on both parts. I don't think Tyrion's thoughts would contradict themselves, but I think it is a cool little tidbit for the reader to go on, if they can remember it when Littlefinger tells Cat it is Tyrion. But up till then and later on he is not the suspect so it does not have relevance except for that one area of time.

Ok - that was the reference, he had brought the wine from the Summer Isles all the way from Casterly Rock - but it does not say anywhere that he left from there to go to Winterfell or that the king stopped there on his way. I assumed first that he was with the King procession the whole way from KL, and there they must have stopped at CR and he brought the wine from there, but you are assuming he met up with them on the Kingsroad from CR.

Ser Gary
User ID: 1523284 Jun 14th 12:51 PM
Right, Ran. And that may well have been the key argument that led us to dismiss Tyrion as a suspect the first time around.

Lodengarl User ID: 0798784	Jun 14th 8:58 AM A couple things I found interesting in my latest re-read of A Game of Thrones. 1) The King's procession traveled from King's Landing, to Casterly Rock, then to Winterfell - this is mentioned very, very briefly in Tyrion's chapter where he is traveling north with Jon and Ben. I never realized this before...not sure what to make of it, just interesting. 2) In the same paragraph and chapter, Tyrion mentions to Jon that he took some rare volumes from the Winterfell Library with the Stark's permission. The very next chapter the library is set on fire in the attempted assassination of Bran. I thought that was a cool, interesting point. Purely coincidental? Possible GRRM throwing us off by putting that in? Possibly. Possible clue that Tyrion wanted Bran dead (did not want to lose some volumes in the library fire), possible. It probably means nothing, but is still interesting to speculate on.
Ser Gary User ID: 1523284	Jun 14th 9:30 AM Someone (maybe it was Min) had once speculated on the possibility that Tyrion was responsible for the attempt on Bran's life. Many people here simply dismissed the notion, given Tyrion's supposed nature and several other rationalizations which escape me now. Let me just throw out this question: Why might Tyrion want Bran dead?
Lodengarl User ID: 0798784	Jun 14th 9:36 AM The only reason is that he is a true Lannister and does love his family...we must realize that he is truly a Lannister and would do anything for his family..maybe Jaime asked him to do his dirty work for him, or maybe Tyrion knew (if you recall the chapter before Tyrion guesses Cersei and Jaime were caught and threw Bran out) and wanted to end it before accusations came out which would harm his family...remember, if Robert did find out he would throw the Lannisters out on their asses...maybe Tyrion, always being dutiful to his family decided to end Bran's life for the good of the family.
Ser Gary User ID: 1523284	Jun 14th 9:51 AM ...and if Tyrion's family goes down, Tyrion starts looking for a job with the circus as opposed to using his smarts to further his political ambitions.
Ran User ID: 0867924	Jun 14th 11:10 AM Gary, The reason it isn't Tyrion is simple -- check the scene in the sky cells. His own thoughts reveal that he wasn't the one behind it, because he was trying to figure out which of his siblings had ordered it. Unless one wants to go with a dual personality type thing, I can't see how Tyrion could be the one behind it, given that. BTW, Lodengarl, I don't believe the king's party went to Casterly Rock first. I'm presuming that you mean the bit where Tyrion thinks of having brought a wine all the way north from Casterly Rock -- which doesn't say too much. As far as I recall, he wasn't actually in KL at the time of Robert's departure, and may have ridden out from the Rock to join his siblings after learning of it. Or, alternatively, the bottle of wine had been acquired in Casterly Rock, he had kept it when he went to KL, and from there went to the North. If there's something that specifically says the king went to Casterly Rock first -- and I can't see as he would have, given that he had a long enough trip as it was -- I can't find it, though I've skimmed.
Lodengarl User ID: 0798784	Jun 14th 11:16 AM Ran, you are right on both parts. I don't think Tyrion's thoughts would contradict themselves, but I think it is a cool little tidbit for the reader to go on, if they can remember it when Littlefinger tells Cat it is Tyrion. But up till then and later on he is not the suspect so it does not have relevance except for that one area of time. Ok - that was the reference, he had brought the wine from the Summer Isles all the way from Casterly Rock - but it does not say anywhere that he left from there to go to Winterfell or that the king stopped there on his way. I assumed first that he was with the King procession the whole way from KL, and there they must have stopped at CR and he brought the wine from there, but you are assuming he met up with them on the Kingsroad from CR.
Ser Gary User ID: 1523284	Jun 14th 12:51 PM Right, Ran. And that may well have been the key argument that led us to dismiss Tyrion as a suspect the first time around.