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A Song of Ice and Fire / A Song of Ice and Fire / ASoIaF In Schools?

Next 20 Messages

Ran
User ID: 0743024 Sep 7th 4:07 AM
Rhaegar posted:

from the first time I finished agot I thought that it would make perfect literature for school (I am 17, and a junior who is presently in English honors). Now I think that the entire series would make the perfect books for school. The different themes and twists that the characters are subjected to are very intriguing, and could make for some serious classroom discussion about the books. Also the fact that the book doesn't "lie" to students, telling them that everything works out in the end if you do the right thing, both men and women can kill and destroy things both lovely and tainted with ease, and that the good guys usually don't win, and if they did then they most likely rewrote the history (to the victor goes the telling of the tale) to make it sound like they were in the right and didn't stab a dozen people in the back on the way up. Plus there are enough blood/sex/death to keep the most bored people interested.

What do you think???---and yes, I know the series will not be done when I have graduated..from college, but still in your opinion don't these books seems perfectly suited for school?? much better that harry potter at least

Ran
User ID: 0743024 Sep 7th 4:08 AM
Bowerin posted:

hear hear rhaegar, i like the gut of your gib... i studied a bunch of books at school, and some of them were really bad. something like martin would be good, but there would be massive uproar if any of the parents ever read the books...

Emilie posted:

Maybe the books will be a subject in the classroom...in college, here parents do not usually protest about sexual content in English class novels. I took a class in college called "Modern Science Fiction", an English Lit class. No Fantasy, iunfortunately, it was all "hard" s/f; but still fun.

Ran
User ID: 0743024 Sep 7th 4:11 AM
Alexaendra posted:

Well, my opinion on the subject is that I totally agree! They should be read to people ages 1-infinity!

I am 13 and have several friends my age whom have read AGoT and CoK. Their parents don't object because we all have been exposed to sexual content whether we want to be or not. In these books however, we can see the motives behind things like violence, sex, betrayal, etc. through the eyes of the POV Character.

This may sound strange, but my mom (who bought the books and told me I should read them) feels that they are a good insight to real life. As my creative writing teacher says, "Daydreaming can save your sanity". This series has many real aspects and many fanciful aspects which IMO makes it the perfect book to analyze. Also it has saved my sanity on more than one occasion. During brainwashing, er Civics, when we watch these pathetic DVD's about America and how to be a good citizen, I sit with a smile on my face thinking of crazy and not so crazy theories about SOS.

All in all, ASoIaF has been a very important part of my reataining what little grip on sanity I have ;) all the while giving me valuable insight to the different personalities people have. Have any of you ever looked at someone you just met or people you know and think, "They have a Sansa complex" or, "He is so Ned Stark"? I do this a lot...especially with my Cersei/Bolton/Frey teachers.

My 2(very long) cents~

Alexaendra

[P.S.]

BTW, I think Harry Potter is good too, but we aren't supposed to read books that "young" in middle school (according to my teachers, one of whom thought I was reading the Bible when I was really reading AGoT)

Ran
User ID: 0743024 Sep 7th 4:12 AM
LindaElane posted:

Gosh, thats interesting. Why did your teacher think AGOT was the Bible?

Ran
User ID: 0743024 Sep 7th 4:13 AM
Bowerin posted:

maybe Alexandra was reading AGOT inside a Bible

amf posted:

maybe it was the girth of the book - a book that thick... it must be the bible!

Lodengarl
User ID: 0798784 Sep 7th 8:07 AM
Wow, Alexandra, you are a smart cookie! All good points! Her teacher thought she was reading a bible because it was so thick probably...are most 13 year olds in the habit of reading 700 page books? I love that...ahahah, Cersei/Frey/Bolton teachers..haahahahah

Rhaegar
User ID: 1258494 Sep 7th 3:36 PM
i am always thinking of the books in school alexandra, and i will admit that many people in my school fit into the character definitions of asoiaf, but where do stupid rednecks (50% of my school)fit????

Relic
User ID: 9328513 Sep 7th 3:37 PM
Hehe.

Omer
User ID: 9551723 Sep 7th 4:01 PM
Well, the truth is, I wouldn't consider ASoIaF great school material, simply because it's so long.

You see, IMHO, one of the reasons you have literature classes in School is to introduce people to a common ground of literature. This is really important, I think. Also, Schools are the place to force the classics on people - maybe not the Boring classics, but good ones. After all, there's a fatchance most of us would read a Greek Drama for fun, right?

Also don't forget that some parents complain about Harry Potter and maintain that it is evil. So just think what would happen if ASoIaF would be common reading material for teenagers?

And of course, I seriously doubt most people, teenagers included, have the ABILITY to read something like ASoIaF

Jeff
User ID: 1536664 Sep 7th 4:53 PM
Well, I'll be the lone voice of dissent here and say no to ASOIAF in schools.

The sexual content doesn't bother me personally, but I think it might bother some other folks. We get a fair description of oral sex, masturbation, etc. I could see how that might be considered over the top by some parents. I'm unwilling to force the book on kids in school because, for such potentially controversial subjects, it should be left up to the parents.

If you disagree, fine. Give the book to your own kids outside of school.

Malice
User ID: 1759784 Sep 7th 10:38 PM
Let's forget the fact the the schools in my area would be hard-pressed to even afford ASOIAF... ;) we have trouble with textbooks. I am somewhat torn... I agree with you, Jeff, to some extent (I may not have a very accurate idea of what a parent feels, but I can imagine...) On the other hand (forgive the queerness of this remark) -- so many kids at my school know the mechanics of the sex described in the books (don't laugh!); and to be honest, I don't know anyone who would even pick up AGOT or ACOK at the school library (be they adolescent OR adult!).

Like Omer said, if people get jittery over Harry Potter...doesn't make me want to bring ASOIAF into the melee...

Alexaedra -- way to go! I began ASOIAF when I was 13 as well (now I'm not much older -- I turned 14 last month). My mother picked AGOT up out of curiosity, and finished it not long after. She said that she liked it, but I don't really know if she did...I think the deaths (among other things) put her off.

So, to close, I think that ASOIAF should not be placed in schools (in general) -- high schools maybe if I were to stretch it, but not middle schools. Parents need peace of mind.

Malice
User ID: 1759784 Sep 7th 11:47 PM
And... they deserve it, too! ;)

Alexaendra
User ID: 1509104 Sep 8th 3:09 PM
Well, my teacher thought that the book was so huge it had to be the Bible, but by the way I act, I wouldn't be reading the Bible in public...anyways...

Lodengarl-Yup, Cersei/Bolton/Frey teachers definately fits, I have teachers who are women and "lust for power" like Cersei, teachers who'd like to flay the skin right off our backs, and I have a teacher who is OLD (like 57) and has 8 kids! (He is mean and talks about how they fling M&M's and Peanut Butter at the walls.

Rhaegar-50% of your school are "stupid rednecks"?
Well, as for the rednecks part, I think Tyrion's Mountain Men are rednecks, but they're not that dumb, so I don't know...

Omer-They ARE long, and in a way, I couldn't see reading it aloud in school (like they do in mine). I mean, I have kids in my class who can't read words like "acquaintances" (sp?). It took us three months to finish "Where the Red Fern Grows" by Wilson Rawls. In a way, it would proably take from 6-12th grades to finish the firt three books.

Mailce-You started it at 13 too? Awesome! My school could afford it, if they WANTED to...they spent $500,000.00 on a new soccer field, even though out Algebra books are 10 years old and *literally* falling apart. In fact, my school, well the High School actually has the students in classic literature bring in/buy their own volumes of Shakespeare, sad, huh? Parents need peace of mind only if they pay attention to their kids. I know most parents KNOW there is an 11:00 p.m. curfew but let their kids go to movies and stay out past one, and if their kids get picked up by the cops, it's as they say "not MY fault".

I'm babbling now, but I'm so happy to be online since my computer crashed like for a day. I'm happy to see all the differences/similarities of opinions here (being off-line for a day bugs me, unless I'm on vacation ;))

~Alexaendra

Bronn
User ID: 6333093 Sep 8th 3:22 PM
Beside Alexaendra, you would not want to read the Bible in school. It is full of sex, betrayals, violence, adultery and other naughty stuff. Kinda short on dragons tho....

Bernie
User ID: 8416263 Sep 8th 5:09 PM
I don't think this book would be a good choice for
a literature class in the United States because
it has far too much graphics and sex for the
general public. I don't know how things stand in
Europe, but here, there are places that have
banned Harry Potter from the school library because of the subject matter. Imagine coupling that with the sexual content and violence in ASoIaF. The books would never make it to the classroom because no teacher is willing to risk such controversy when there are plenty of less controversial books out there.

As for ages to which this book is appropriate, I personally think that no child under the age of 15 should be allowed to read these books without parental guidance. There are events in these books which may cause harm to impressionable young minds without someone to help them put things in perspective. I speak from my own experiences. I read Stephen Donaldson's Chronicles of Thomas Covenant (First and Second) at the tender age of 13, and I don't feel like I understood the characters or the events until I re-read the book several years later. Furthermore, I think it hampered my social skills because I was trying to learn how adults behaved, and Thomas Covenant is a prime example of how adults shouldn't behave. I wish I had had someone around to explain his actions to me. I would have enjoyed the book more, and been that much happier through a significant portion of my teen years.

I know that kids are bombarded with sex and violence anyways, but look at it this way: It may be pouring outside, but that doesn't mean that you should set sprinklers off inside your home. Children should have a safe place, or at least the perception that there is a safe place for them. I'm not saying that your parents were wrong to let you read ASoIaF, Alexaendra. I'm just saying that I won't let mine do so without some serious discussion. Of course, my child is only 18 months old, so she won't even want to read this series for a long time to come :)

Bernie
User ID: 8416263 Sep 8th 5:13 PM
Yikes! I just read my post, and I notice that I mentioned "too much graphics and sex." I'm sorry. I don't think anyone would object to graphics at all... they're all over the Disney movies nowadays :) What I meant to say was violence. The word graphic stuck because of all the movie warnings about graphic violence. One nice thing about books is that there are no graphics, so the violence can be left up to the imagination instead of being graphically displayed. Sorry about that. I hope the post makes more sense, with this correction.

Alexaendra
User ID: 1509104 Sep 8th 7:39 PM
Your post makes more and I can agree with the impressionable age and young minds thing, to a degree. Some kids at 16 can't handle violence while some 10 year olds can. I have a ten year old brother who is reading AGoT now, and he's fine with it. My one neighbor saw "Gladiator" (which I thought was an EXCELLENT movie) and is now mentally disturbed...

I think reading things and uinderstanding them has to do with the level of maturity of the reader.

~Alexaendra

LindaElane
User ID: 0276214 Sep 8th 10:31 PM
I don't mean to be off putting But I do teach in public schools. Look at it this way.

I would imagine 90 percent of the list would object very strongly if they had a child in state schools and if that child's teacher gave them the Bible to read. Ipso facto those people do believe in schools exercising some discretion in what minors read.

Sure, I know about the Harry Potter thing. I think I have also heard of the "reasonable man" test in law. (Sorry, I know that sounds sexist, but I think thats what its called.) Would a reasonable maa think that Harry Potter books teach the religion of witchcraft? So, I don't go along with banning Harry Potter in schools. But that does not mean I go along with everything in schools.

I think Jeff said it very well.

If filmed, ASOS would receive an NC-17 in the states and an NC-15 down under, and I don't know European ratings systems. Give it to your children to read if you want, but parents have a right to ask that their children not read graphic material in school.

If you are in high school and mature enough to read it, I can understand wanting to read it as a school assignment. But please see the comparison. You are mature enough to read the Bible if you want and your teacher is not going to pass that out for you to read. Our society does actually agree on many values, but there are some upon which we disagree and we don't hand out literature about them in schools, be it graphic sex portrayed to a minor or religion.

And, truth be told, I head up a department at a high school and I know about fear of lawsuits. Your school would get a huge one if it handed out books with graphic descriptions of oral sex, incest, rape of children and everything else that is in the books. They can't afford it, they would go broke. So, beside the fact that it is wrong to force parents to let their minor children read this stuff, its not going to happen because it would cost too much money. Sorry to be blunt, but its reality.

Malice
User ID: 1759784 Sep 8th 11:09 PM
I like to imagine the reading "Lord Foul's Bane" last year did not make me mentally unstable. :) It wasn't a prime example of good fantasy writing in my opinion, and I never did get around to the rest of the series. Covenant himself is very often a jerk and "what an adult should not be" -- but when I think about it the ("good") characters of the Land have remarkable tolerable, friendly, and wise attitudes (before Foul screws with their brains).

LindaElane -- this is true, schools will be unable to afford all of the books. But if they are placed on the shelves at my school library (by some twist of fate), I can solemnly swear that no one would pick them up (besides me and maybe a librarian or two).

M.

REDHORN
User ID: 9391453 Sep 9th 0:28 AM
LindaElaine, I back all of your arguments up, and believe wholeheartedly in what you are speaking of, but everyone else, I don't see the logic in your arguments. Why should ASOIAF be brought into the setting of a school? It's an excellent fantasy series, by no doubt, but it would just never work in school. It's too long, and too distant from what the average student would face in most english courses. Introducing this series to even a high school student would create false ideas of how an "immortal" novel is structured. And frankly, there are better books which are one tenth the length, and a damn high amount of them.

Next 20 Messages

Ran User ID: 0743024	Sep 7th 4:07 AM Rhaegar posted: from the first time I finished agot I thought that it would make perfect literature for school (I am 17, and a junior who is presently in English honors). Now I think that the entire series would make the perfect books for school. The different themes and twists that the characters are subjected to are very intriguing, and could make for some serious classroom discussion about the books. Also the fact that the book doesn't "lie" to students, telling them that everything works out in the end if you do the right thing, both men and women can kill and destroy things both lovely and tainted with ease, and that the good guys usually don't win, and if they did then they most likely rewrote the history (to the victor goes the telling of the tale) to make it sound like they were in the right and didn't stab a dozen people in the back on the way up. Plus there are enough blood/sex/death to keep the most bored people interested. What do you think???---and yes, I know the series will not be done when I have graduated..from college, but still in your opinion don't these books seems perfectly suited for school?? much better that harry potter at least
Ran User ID: 0743024	Sep 7th 4:08 AM Bowerin posted: hear hear rhaegar, i like the gut of your gib... i studied a bunch of books at school, and some of them were really bad. something like martin would be good, but there would be massive uproar if any of the parents ever read the books... Emilie posted: Maybe the books will be a subject in the classroom...in college, here parents do not usually protest about sexual content in English class novels. I took a class in college called "Modern Science Fiction", an English Lit class. No Fantasy, iunfortunately, it was all "hard" s/f; but still fun.
Ran User ID: 0743024	Sep 7th 4:11 AM Alexaendra posted: Well, my opinion on the subject is that I totally agree! They should be read to people ages 1-infinity! I am 13 and have several friends my age whom have read AGoT and CoK. Their parents don't object because we all have been exposed to sexual content whether we want to be or not. In these books however, we can see the motives behind things like violence, sex, betrayal, etc. through the eyes of the POV Character. This may sound strange, but my mom (who bought the books and told me I should read them) feels that they are a good insight to real life. As my creative writing teacher says, "Daydreaming can save your sanity". This series has many real aspects and many fanciful aspects which IMO makes it the perfect book to analyze. Also it has saved my sanity on more than one occasion. During brainwashing, er Civics, when we watch these pathetic DVD's about America and how to be a good citizen, I sit with a smile on my face thinking of crazy and not so crazy theories about SOS. All in all, ASoIaF has been a very important part of my reataining what little grip on sanity I have ;) all the while giving me valuable insight to the different personalities people have. Have any of you ever looked at someone you just met or people you know and think, "They have a Sansa complex" or, "He is so Ned Stark"? I do this a lot...especially with my Cersei/Bolton/Frey teachers. My 2(very long) cents~ Alexaendra [P.S.] BTW, I think Harry Potter is good too, but we aren't supposed to read books that "young" in middle school (according to my teachers, one of whom thought I was reading the Bible when I was really reading AGoT)
Ran User ID: 0743024	Sep 7th 4:12 AM LindaElane posted: Gosh, thats interesting. Why did your teacher think AGOT was the Bible?
Ran User ID: 0743024	Sep 7th 4:13 AM Bowerin posted: maybe Alexandra was reading AGOT inside a Bible amf posted: maybe it was the girth of the book - a book that thick... it must be the bible!
Lodengarl User ID: 0798784	Sep 7th 8:07 AM Wow, Alexandra, you are a smart cookie! All good points! Her teacher thought she was reading a bible because it was so thick probably...are most 13 year olds in the habit of reading 700 page books? I love that...ahahah, Cersei/Frey/Bolton teachers..haahahahah
Rhaegar User ID: 1258494	Sep 7th 3:36 PM i am always thinking of the books in school alexandra, and i will admit that many people in my school fit into the character definitions of asoiaf, but where do stupid rednecks (50% of my school)fit????
Relic User ID: 9328513	Sep 7th 3:37 PM Hehe.
Omer User ID: 9551723	Sep 7th 4:01 PM Well, the truth is, I wouldn't consider ASoIaF great school material, simply because it's so long. You see, IMHO, one of the reasons you have literature classes in School is to introduce people to a common ground of literature. This is really important, I think. Also, Schools are the place to force the classics on people - maybe not the Boring classics, but good ones. After all, there's a fatchance most of us would read a Greek Drama for fun, right? Also don't forget that some parents complain about Harry Potter and maintain that it is evil. So just think what would happen if ASoIaF would be common reading material for teenagers? And of course, I seriously doubt most people, teenagers included, have the ABILITY to read something like ASoIaF
Jeff User ID: 1536664	Sep 7th 4:53 PM Well, I'll be the lone voice of dissent here and say no to ASOIAF in schools. The sexual content doesn't bother me personally, but I think it might bother some other folks. We get a fair description of oral sex, masturbation, etc. I could see how that might be considered over the top by some parents. I'm unwilling to force the book on kids in school because, for such potentially controversial subjects, it should be left up to the parents. If you disagree, fine. Give the book to your own kids outside of school.
Malice User ID: 1759784	Sep 7th 10:38 PM Let's forget the fact the the schools in my area would be hard-pressed to even afford ASOIAF... ;) we have trouble with textbooks. I am somewhat torn... I agree with you, Jeff, to some extent (I may not have a very accurate idea of what a parent feels, but I can imagine...) On the other hand (forgive the queerness of this remark) -- so many kids at my school know the mechanics of the sex described in the books (don't laugh!); and to be honest, I don't know anyone who would even pick up AGOT or ACOK at the school library (be they adolescent OR adult!). Like Omer said, if people get jittery over Harry Potter...doesn't make me want to bring ASOIAF into the melee... Alexaedra -- way to go! I began ASOIAF when I was 13 as well (now I'm not much older -- I turned 14 last month). My mother picked AGOT up out of curiosity, and finished it not long after. She said that she liked it, but I don't really know if she did...I think the deaths (among other things) put her off. So, to close, I think that ASOIAF should not be placed in schools (in general) -- high schools maybe if I were to stretch it, but not middle schools. Parents need peace of mind.
Malice User ID: 1759784	Sep 7th 11:47 PM And... they deserve it, too! ;)
Alexaendra User ID: 1509104	Sep 8th 3:09 PM Well, my teacher thought that the book was so huge it had to be the Bible, but by the way I act, I wouldn't be reading the Bible in public...anyways... Lodengarl-Yup, Cersei/Bolton/Frey teachers definately fits, I have teachers who are women and "lust for power" like Cersei, teachers who'd like to flay the skin right off our backs, and I have a teacher who is OLD (like 57) and has 8 kids! (He is mean and talks about how they fling M&M's and Peanut Butter at the walls. Rhaegar-50% of your school are "stupid rednecks"? Well, as for the rednecks part, I think Tyrion's Mountain Men are rednecks, but they're not that dumb, so I don't know... Omer-They ARE long, and in a way, I couldn't see reading it aloud in school (like they do in mine). I mean, I have kids in my class who can't read words like "acquaintances" (sp?). It took us three months to finish "Where the Red Fern Grows" by Wilson Rawls. In a way, it would proably take from 6-12th grades to finish the firt three books. Mailce-You started it at 13 too? Awesome! My school could afford it, if they WANTED to...they spent $500,000.00 on a new soccer field, even though out Algebra books are 10 years old and literally falling apart. In fact, my school, well the High School actually has the students in classic literature bring in/buy their own volumes of Shakespeare, sad, huh? Parents need peace of mind only if they pay attention to their kids. I know most parents KNOW there is an 11:00 p.m. curfew but let their kids go to movies and stay out past one, and if their kids get picked up by the cops, it's as they say "not MY fault". I'm babbling now, but I'm so happy to be online since my computer crashed like for a day. I'm happy to see all the differences/similarities of opinions here (being off-line for a day bugs me, unless I'm on vacation ;)) ~Alexaendra
Bronn User ID: 6333093	Sep 8th 3:22 PM Beside Alexaendra, you would not want to read the Bible in school. It is full of sex, betrayals, violence, adultery and other naughty stuff. Kinda short on dragons tho....
Bernie User ID: 8416263	Sep 8th 5:09 PM I don't think this book would be a good choice for a literature class in the United States because it has far too much graphics and sex for the general public. I don't know how things stand in Europe, but here, there are places that have banned Harry Potter from the school library because of the subject matter. Imagine coupling that with the sexual content and violence in ASoIaF. The books would never make it to the classroom because no teacher is willing to risk such controversy when there are plenty of less controversial books out there. As for ages to which this book is appropriate, I personally think that no child under the age of 15 should be allowed to read these books without parental guidance. There are events in these books which may cause harm to impressionable young minds without someone to help them put things in perspective. I speak from my own experiences. I read Stephen Donaldson's Chronicles of Thomas Covenant (First and Second) at the tender age of 13, and I don't feel like I understood the characters or the events until I re-read the book several years later. Furthermore, I think it hampered my social skills because I was trying to learn how adults behaved, and Thomas Covenant is a prime example of how adults shouldn't behave. I wish I had had someone around to explain his actions to me. I would have enjoyed the book more, and been that much happier through a significant portion of my teen years. I know that kids are bombarded with sex and violence anyways, but look at it this way: It may be pouring outside, but that doesn't mean that you should set sprinklers off inside your home. Children should have a safe place, or at least the perception that there is a safe place for them. I'm not saying that your parents were wrong to let you read ASoIaF, Alexaendra. I'm just saying that I won't let mine do so without some serious discussion. Of course, my child is only 18 months old, so she won't even want to read this series for a long time to come :)
Bernie User ID: 8416263	Sep 8th 5:13 PM Yikes! I just read my post, and I notice that I mentioned "too much graphics and sex." I'm sorry. I don't think anyone would object to graphics at all... they're all over the Disney movies nowadays :) What I meant to say was violence. The word graphic stuck because of all the movie warnings about graphic violence. One nice thing about books is that there are no graphics, so the violence can be left up to the imagination instead of being graphically displayed. Sorry about that. I hope the post makes more sense, with this correction.
Alexaendra User ID: 1509104	Sep 8th 7:39 PM Your post makes more and I can agree with the impressionable age and young minds thing, to a degree. Some kids at 16 can't handle violence while some 10 year olds can. I have a ten year old brother who is reading AGoT now, and he's fine with it. My one neighbor saw "Gladiator" (which I thought was an EXCELLENT movie) and is now mentally disturbed... I think reading things and uinderstanding them has to do with the level of maturity of the reader. ~Alexaendra
LindaElane User ID: 0276214	Sep 8th 10:31 PM I don't mean to be off putting But I do teach in public schools. Look at it this way. I would imagine 90 percent of the list would object very strongly if they had a child in state schools and if that child's teacher gave them the Bible to read. Ipso facto those people do believe in schools exercising some discretion in what minors read. Sure, I know about the Harry Potter thing. I think I have also heard of the "reasonable man" test in law. (Sorry, I know that sounds sexist, but I think thats what its called.) Would a reasonable maa think that Harry Potter books teach the religion of witchcraft? So, I don't go along with banning Harry Potter in schools. But that does not mean I go along with everything in schools. I think Jeff said it very well. If filmed, ASOS would receive an NC-17 in the states and an NC-15 down under, and I don't know European ratings systems. Give it to your children to read if you want, but parents have a right to ask that their children not read graphic material in school. If you are in high school and mature enough to read it, I can understand wanting to read it as a school assignment. But please see the comparison. You are mature enough to read the Bible if you want and your teacher is not going to pass that out for you to read. Our society does actually agree on many values, but there are some upon which we disagree and we don't hand out literature about them in schools, be it graphic sex portrayed to a minor or religion. And, truth be told, I head up a department at a high school and I know about fear of lawsuits. Your school would get a huge one if it handed out books with graphic descriptions of oral sex, incest, rape of children and everything else that is in the books. They can't afford it, they would go broke. So, beside the fact that it is wrong to force parents to let their minor children read this stuff, its not going to happen because it would cost too much money. Sorry to be blunt, but its reality.
Malice User ID: 1759784	Sep 8th 11:09 PM I like to imagine the reading "Lord Foul's Bane" last year did not make me mentally unstable. :) It wasn't a prime example of good fantasy writing in my opinion, and I never did get around to the rest of the series. Covenant himself is very often a jerk and "what an adult should not be" -- but when I think about it the ("good") characters of the Land have remarkable tolerable, friendly, and wise attitudes (before Foul screws with their brains). LindaElane -- this is true, schools will be unable to afford all of the books. But if they are placed on the shelves at my school library (by some twist of fate), I can solemnly swear that no one would pick them up (besides me and maybe a librarian or two). M.
REDHORN User ID: 9391453	Sep 9th 0:28 AM LindaElaine, I back all of your arguments up, and believe wholeheartedly in what you are speaking of, but everyone else, I don't see the logic in your arguments. Why should ASOIAF be brought into the setting of a school? It's an excellent fantasy series, by no doubt, but it would just never work in school. It's too long, and too distant from what the average student would face in most english courses. Introducing this series to even a high school student would create false ideas of how an "immortal" novel is structured. And frankly, there are better books which are one tenth the length, and a damn high amount of them.