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Quoting Terence Brown

Joyce & Yeats

Doubting Thomas

More thoughts

A little cloud

 

chandra, thanks much for the summary of brown's remarks... just a knee

jerk reaction to something he asserted...

"...indicates that Joyce considered the Celtic Twilight school to be opportunistic and lacking in artistic integrity. It was a means to easy literary success, especially in England."

...whether joyce felt that way or not is certainly debatable, but one thing is sure, the celtic literary renaissance was possibly the closest thing to yeats' heart, besides maude gonne, his beloved. :-) for yeats, this was part of the cultural awakening of the irish catholic (tho he was not one) spirit and heritage after 7 centuries of british colonialism... yeats was an ardent republican and freedom fighter/believer (also a close associate of tagore's and a believer in, if not hinduism, then hindu philosophical views)... so for joyce to assert that it was a form of opportunism, kissing up to the british or that the movement was shallow and meaningless is all hogwash, blarney and the ramblings of a drunken irish sailor... ;-))

'tis true that joyce and yeats' views, politically, culturally and artistically, were worlds apart despite their close proximity and assumed brotherhood... the difference is evident. one fact that may account for it in part -- joyce, as far as famous noted irish authors goes, was an outsider. why? because he was a catholic. yeats, shaw, swift, wilde, and almost every other irish author of note (save brian friel and a few other scrappers! :) were anglo-irish, ie: descended of the british aristocracy in ireland; *hence*, to irish catholics they were children of the landed gentry and not *real* irishmen; to indigenous irish, they are outsiders. however, in joyce's circle within the irish geography, *he* was the outsider -- that is, literary circles. lady gregory and yeats were both descended anglo-irish and so were their powerful friends. so, it is understandable, based both on joyce's personality and on his position as an outsider, to have such views.

he may have looked at these folks as people who only *think* they understand the irish catholic plight, the troubles of the subjugated colonial subject, and one who is doubly subjugated, by britain and by the catholic church (joyce's view). so he may have looked at yeats as an irish catholic sympathizer, much the way some indians might view western indophiles... ;-) or some indians view NRI's.

but i believe yeats had a pure heart and genuinely pursued the renaissance, much as he became disgusted because ardent irish catholics responded negatively to anything staged that went against the grain of the almighty catholic church.

some of these things we see chronicled in both joyce and yeats' works. the views joyce had towards irish vs. anglo-irish and related class issues are seen in for example _a day at the races_ and _a little cloud_, in addition both authors chronicled their frustrations at the way too devoted irish catholics -- joyce in his commentaries related to the hero parnell (_portrait..._) yeats in many of his poems including _1919_, and others.

at some point after we have gotten thru joyce, we should think about switching over to yeats for a time. he is as important as joyce and more beloved to the irish because he loved ireland and his heart was with the concerns of the indigenous irish catholic and our plight(s).

yeats was a magnificently brilliant person and studied eastern philosophy with not only tagore, but another prominent figure whose name escapes. he translated the upanishads with this man... he also translated tagore's work. regarding the lady gregory/yeats renaissance and their legacy, see yeats' book translated from the gaelic, "irish legends and folktales," with a final section translated by lady gregory which is the story of celtic hero cuchulain... he is our arjuna. :-))

sorry to go on and on but some things get my irish blood brewing...
slainte',
maureen.

oops... i forgot to say that i think joyce felt that the view of ireland he presented in his work was the only truly valid and honest view, whereas that presented by people like yeats was 'romanticized', out of touch and way too kind...

an author like mistry i might imagine having a similar view as this towards some of his contemporaries...

just a t'awt, lads and lassies...

m.

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